Part 3 of a 3 part series.

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He used to be a hero, but now he exploits the abuse of children for views and money. In the 80s and 90s, he was a hard-hitting journalist, tackling some incredibly important stories that shed light on issues like slave labor, the crack cocaine epidemic, and child trafficking. In the early 2000s he was host of the insanely popular TV show, To Catch a Predator. For a while, Chris Hansen was a legitimate celebrity, probably the most famous of any reporter, and beloved by all as a literal hero doing a great public service. However, somewhere along the way he lost sight of the altruistic nature of what he was doing, and now he spends his days shamelessly exploiting underage abuse victims for YouTube views and a quick buck. In part 3 of Deep Cuts’ exploration of Hansen, we look at the increasingly unfortunate YouTube career of Hansen, his dealings with pyramid schemes and scams, and ultimately reflect on his larger role in the damage caused to several of the victims he purported to help.

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transcript

(0s):
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(43s):
Plus start your free trial today. Welcome to true crime by Indy drop-in each week, we feature an episode from the best independent creators hit subscribe for more great, true crime content. If you would like to help indie drop in support indie creators, you can buy us a coffee, just go to buy me a coffee.com forward slash indie drop-in or click the link in the show notes below today’s episode is from deep cuts. Don’t forget to check out the show notes for links to subscribe and follow on social media. Enjoy the show Listener warning. On this episode, we deal with subjects related to child abuse and trafficking, and we had to touch on these topics in a few places.

(1m 25s):
Listener discretion is advised. And before we start the episode, we’d like to acknowledge and apologize for content. In episode two, during the section about the uneasy on case in our attempt to clearly establish a timeline of events, as well as make clear the type of abuse perpetrated by onesie on, and the perceived target of that abuse. We inadvertently use deadnaming language towards a trans person. This was not our intention. And we plan to be much more careful and responsible with this language moving forward. I’m Dave baker and I am Andrew Price and I’m Chris Hanson and welcome to deep cuts the podcast where we pick a topic and walk you through the ins outs in the nitty gritty. So then you could appear like an interesting and idiosyncratic person and your next forced social function.

(2m 11s):
Today’s topic is Chris Hanson, part three, who is Chris Hansen. He’s an award winning journalist with a storied career that dates back decades and involves many impressive feats of investigative reporting. Previously on deep cuts, we’ve chronicled how Chris Hanson has gone from beloved media icon to YouTube. Pseudo con man is once respected journalist found himself over a million dollars in debt, scanning people for nickels and dimes for new content that never materialized and then becoming transfixed by the story of utuber and accused child predator onesie. On in this final installment, we show you the depths of darkness that Chris Hanson has weighted into and definitively prove that even someone who has helped arrest 300 child predators can become a feeling Good evening, everyone, and welcome to have a seat with Chris Hansen.

(3m 24s):
The numbers are staggering for COVID-19 across the country. There are 150,000 cases, 3,800 deaths, but this whole thing just screamed like a fraud and scam. And the fact that, you know, Chris Hanson was willing to promote it on his stream, made it all the more comical, actually our medical director for a firm that has technology that’s called nano vapor biotech. Tell me what that is. How does it apply to this pandemic? There was a lot being sent on social media about some sort of harassment complaints filed against me in New Jersey. Let me be very clear. It is nonsense. It was filed by Vincent Nicole Tron and his lawyer, sister Francis, Nicole, who practices law in Jersey city, New Jersey, Hey guys, Chris Hanson here of Hanson versus predators.

(4m 13s):
And to catch a predator. I just wanted to tell you all that I’ve seen this amazing new smartphone called the Escobar full today. I got into the onesie on investigation because quite frankly, you all asked me to do it. Television has the potential to take this to a wider audience into increase the potential that we will see justice. We are not a fan rumors began back in 2009. I played a show and after the show I had relations with a woman. And after I had relations with a woman, she seemed to have underlying mental issues Or the whole alcohol thing is he, you know, was seeking a strengths. And eventually my mom went to bed and me and my friend retreated to my room and he could tell that me and my friend had crushes on each other.

(4m 58s):
So he ate 24, 25 year old man. It starts asking us if we like each other, if we’ve ever kissed and prompting us to kiss in front of him, pleasure tonight to have as our guests, insane clown, posse, violent J, and shaky to dope. Joining us tonight from the Detroit area. Do you feel like he is helping the investigation itself? And I think that we have to be specific about that question because we’re saying the investigation, right? And we’re not talking about like, I guess, cause I mean, from my perception, it seems like he’s, he certainly has helped to get awareness. they just want you to take a seat. There’s been this account going around for the past few months and the anonymous, Jean Chris Hanson directly works with this account and this account has done some pretty disturbing things that I wanted to bring to light.

(5m 47s):
And hopefully I can get a response from Chris regarding this account and whether he endorses this and whether he will continue to work with this account in the future, this account has directly spread to the doctors, have an ETL, his family members, including his father, mother, sisters, and more all in these images or in the Google docs folders. And there’s been a lot of that going on and he’s done this in the past and he kept on doing it until he kept on getting suspended in here. We’re going to need you to have a seat right over there. So you can listen to the new episode of deep cuts where Dave and Andrew dive into the story of one of history’s most notorious Kahneman, I’ll be watching it Act five, the sports car ain’t going, gonna lease itself by March of 2020 Chris Hanson, once lauded as a hero and protector was basically a complete joke, shared exclusively in the YouTube creator community.

(6m 51s):
Most people not even aware of this bizarre new chapter in Hanson’s career retained their nostalgic ideal version of T cap era handsome unburdened by the knowledge of the true extent of how far he had fallen. And then boom. Remember what happened in March of 2020. You’re either listening to this episode around the time it came out and it’s still fresh on your mind or you’re the great, great, great grandchildren to the people of the before times studying the remaining clues of what life was like before the blast. In which case, please also listen to our upcoming episode on Q Anon because it’ll clear up some things. Once COVID-19 gripped its shitty spiky, annoying little clutches around the neck of the world, Hanson, deciding that he should probably take a break from white, knuckling it through an ongoing sexual assault case.

(7m 34s):
He didn’t fully understand shifted focus to a light puff piece about a global pandemic. Perhaps Hansen could finally deliver some competent reporting after all this was more in his wheelhouse and he had won Emmys in the past for his coverage of global crises. Maybe that whole thing was a clusterfuck, but surely he could handle reporting on a virus. Nope, use it as a shameless opportunity to compromise his morals and journalistic ethics to make money. He invites Dr. Maricio Meglietti the founder of a company called nano vapor biotech onto his live stream to talk about a new invention they developed that can disinfect areas and clear them of Corona virus and keep them clean for up to 70 to 90 days. Although it was framed as an interview with Dr. Famiglietti to discuss the product.

(8m 14s):
It’s just a blatant promo that he was paid to do. Hansen asks no probing questions at all, but rather acts as the assistant on one of those late night infomercials reacting incredulously and hanging on to every word of the person demonstrating the product Dr. Michael yada U S actually our medical director for a firm that has technology that’s called nano vapor biotech. Tell me what that is. How does it apply to this pandemic? We have a non-toxic water-based no residue product that can be applied to any surface and not only does it immediately kill the virus, but incredibly our research is showing that it will kill the virus that comes into contact with that service for up to 70 to 90 days.

(9m 7s):
And this is approved by the government, by the FDA. This is an FDA approved product. What has to happen To use this in the places we needed? So critically now. So we are, we are ready to use this. We’ve been using this now is just increasing awareness. Is This a game changer? We are hopeful that it is. We have some scientific evidence that it is extremely promising. We’re going to put that link up here on this channel and I’ll put it out on social media too. So folks should become aware of this. I appreciate that. No, really 70 to 90 days. Wow. Pretty much. It, it is just, it’s just an infomercial through zoom, zoom, infomercial.

(9m 51s):
Yep. Viewers are rightfully incredibly dubious of the claims the company made about the product and people start digging only to find that the website for the product had been created literally the day before the live stream with Hansen, the company’s Twitter page had five followers. Its Facebook page had two likes and the website only featured one single case study giving any indication that the product could actually do what they claimed it could do. The study was two pages long and credited to private medical clinic, AKA the medical clinic that conducted the case study for whatever reason, didn’t want their name associated with the product. Shortly after the stream with Hansen, the company removed any and all mentioned of the product, killing coronavirus from their website and rebranded it as a pretty run of the mill hospital grade disinfectant and turns out the product had only ever been tested in one single environment, the hospital where the company’s founder worked.

(10m 39s):
And if all that didn’t convince you that this whole thing was a complete sham. YouTube took down Hanson stream a few days later for violating community guidelines, AKA spreading misinformation about the coronavirus, which YouTube was heavily cracking down on at the time, he seems to have completely just abandoned all notions of ethics. At this point, shamelessly plugging unproven products for profit. He starts a cameo profile, a website where fans can pay celebrities to record video messages, talking about a topic of their request, where he literally will say anything for $50, literally anything he’ll endorse her business. Say whatever you ask him to word for word, or even criticize himself. Vince Palamara, Vince Palomar.

(11m 21s):
What does it himself so distributed, familiar, maybe because your secret screen name is Vince pals, 69. What do you mean by Vince pals? 69, going through some transcripts. I don’t like what I see. You know, we’re still climbing out of a pandemic fence. You’re still supposed to be socially distant, flattening the curve, running around town, getting online, saying, and doing things and suspicious chat rooms. It’s a sort of activity that could lead you to meet me in a dark kitchen someplace, having to call your lovely wife to throw your bail. Nobody wants that. So behavior you I’m often asked if we ever see two different predators show up at the same time at the same investigation. And the answer is yes, it’s happened a few occasions, but this is the first time I’ve seen 1, 2, 3, possibly four but three for short predators surface at the same time at the same investigation, Kai, Nick, Nick suspicious.

(12m 16s):
Peder like you need the stop. Simpy Cod use your money for your computer. Not Patriot is for you. Nick Duda. I’ve got my ID and Nick Hoover quite later, Hey everyone, Chris Hanson here in Hanson versus predators to catch a predator and have a seat with Chris Hanson. And I’m going to need you all to have a seat right over there, because I want you to know that the love all LGBTQ plus support community has some exciting news. Now they’ve added maps to the collection. I think this is important and it’s important to share this love. So you take care, take advantage of this, the LBGTQ Laval collection.

(12m 60s):
Remember I’ll be watching Chris Hanson here. I’m going to need you to have a seat right over there. So you can listen to the new episode of deep cuts where Dave and Andrew dive into the story of one of history’s most notorious Kahneman I’ll be watching and listening. We pay him $50 to do the intro to this very podcast, as well as shoot a video of him advertising the podcast and social media, where he calls himself a con man, he also wants shot a cameo for a troll where he got him to congratulate a kid on graduating from the Epstein flight school before even graduating from high school.

(13m 40s):
Very cool. So congratulations. I hear you’ve gotten into the Epstein pilot program before even finishing high school, tremendous Chris Hanson, the godfather of taking down child predators, didn’t exercise, even the most basic level of self-awareness to stop and think about what he was saying there. What did, what did you think, whatever I sent you, the recordings of Chris Hanson. I mean, I think, you know what I thought, cause you recorded it and I thought it was hilarious.

(14m 31s):
Aye. Aye, aye. For listeners of, of the show who are in the Facebook group and if you’re not, you should our Facebook group, The deep cuts podcast, Facebook group on FA on Facebook. So really cool community where we talk about episodes and people share things related to episodes. And we have, we have fun discussions. One of the, one of the listeners in our show or in the group actually went to school in Texas.

(15m 11s):
And after the JJ arms episode shared a whole story in there about how JJ arms came to their school as a kid and landed in a helicopter on their like playground and everything. He was so wild to actually like talk to someone who had actual interaction with JJ arms. Yeah. People, people share really cool stories. Not all of them are like, oh, I personally interacted with the person you talked about or whatever, but people will come and share personal anecdotes related to the show or cool stories like that. And there’s a lot of just further discussion about episodes. So that alone is a really cool reason to join the group because like, there’s literally like hundreds of comments worth of discussion about like Andrew WK.

(15m 56s):
We, we, we, we, we talked about so much more about that show. Like you could almost do like a whole followup episode with like some of the stuff we discussed in the Facebook group about Andrew WK after the episode came out. So yeah, join the, join the group. But if you’re in the group, I shared, I, whenever I showed Dave these recordings that we got, first of all, I had this idea to do this. And I was like, oh shit, like Chris Hanson will just say whatever you want. Then I had seen some of the, so many other YouTubers and things talking about it and saying, like doing their own versions of it. Like they paid him to say weird shit.

(16m 37s):
And they were like, he’ll say anything. And I saw some of these recordings and I was like, yeah, he looks, it looks like he will just literally word for word. Just say whatever you want from him. And he won’t even apply critical thinking to what he’s saying. He just, he wants the $50 and he’ll just read your thing with his brain turned off. So I was like, fuck it. I’m just going to try this. So we paid him a hundred dollars to do two videos. One of them was doing the intro to the podcast and making it seem like he was going to be a guest on the podcast. And the other one was like a, like a shoutout social media post. So it’s him like being like, listen, listen to the new episode.

(17m 17s):
That’s about this and calling himself a con man. And I sent these requests in and the thing, the thing on, on cameo, if you don’t know, cameo is a website where there’s a bunch of celebrities on there and you can pay them various amounts of money to get them to send you video messages. It’s kind of like a very tame version of only fans where you can kind of get a, you can get mark McGrath from sugar Ray to wish you happy birthday. So I sent him these requests at like midnight. Like I had this idea late at night while I was like researching. And I sent these requests in at midnight. And the thing on cameo said that Chris Hanson typically turns around a request within three to seven days, less than 24 hours later, the next day at like 10 30, he sent them back and they were just exactly what I asked for.

(18m 17s):
He, he read the intro to the show and he, he, he did this, this promo and whenever I saw them, cause they, they sent, they got sent to me by text. So I actually got notifications of this. And whenever I opened them, I, I screamed so hard that the previous night, California, Los Angeles in kind of the outer lying area had a fairly large earthquake. That was like, I was sitting there on my couch and my wife was, was in the bedroom, like putting the kids to sleep or maybe she was already asleep or something like that.

(18m 59s):
And this, this earthquake just like shook the whole house. And it just felt it had this like really loud rumbling sound. And I like ran up and ran into the room and like got in bed with him or whatever. And then there was an aftershock. So this was the next day. So I was literally like, there was, it was like dead silence on the house. I was working in a room and then suddenly my wife just hears me go, oh my God. And she thought that another earthquake was happening and she ran and she was like, what’s going on? And I was like, Chris Hansen, look, Chris Hanson made videos for us. And so I was like, at first I was just going to send you the videos, like text them to you.

(19m 41s):
But then I was like, fuck that. And so I just, I called Dave on zoom and I shared the screen and I re started recording and I was like, you ready for something? And then I just played them and I, and I recorded your reaction. And then I posted it out of context on the Facebook group, just the video of your reaction. And I was like, Hmm, what is Dave reacting to? So this is the, this is the reveal of what that was. I think it’s, I mean, I’m, I’m pretty proud of multiple of the episodes, but I think that is the crowning achievement for the deep Crow, for the deep cuts empire. I think getting him to do that, especially because like, it’s funny how sometimes I’ve made things in, I’ve made things in my life where I’ve been like, oh, this is gonna work or, oh, I’m really proud of this.

(20m 34s):
And I think this is really cool. I hope people like it. But as soon as I wrote the intro, the first time to deep, to the deep cuts of like, you know, where we walked through the nitty gritty and blabbity blah, I was like, that’ll stick. I know that this will stick. And it, and I’ve Had people in real life walk up to me and like, say it word for word. Yeah. And people’s, yeah. People say it all the time for Chris Hanson to say it is so fucking funny. And he just, he does. He reads it word for word in the Chris Hanson voice. I’m Chris Hanson, welcome to deep care, the podcast where we pick a topic and walking through the ends and the nitty gritty.

(21m 18s):
So you could appear like an interesting and idiosyncratic person at your next forced social function. He’s just milking every one of those words, man, if it wasn’t already incredibly surreal to have Chris Hansen reading that intro to our show, just knowing who he is and his existence within the pop cultural and cultural space. It was even more surreal for me to hear him saying that after how deep into Chris Hanson I had gone with the research. Yeah, you’d got, you’d gone full Chrissy hand, hand. Yeah. I was like, I was, I was deep, deep down in the, in the Chris hole and to have after that and have his speech cadence become so like kind of stuck in my mind to have him read that was just fucking nuts.

(22m 14s):
And I, and I want to talk a little bit more about that in a second, a little bit, a little cup, a couple steps further in the episode, I want to go back to what we did and our recording, and kind of give a, give a, give a philosophical reason for why we did it. It wasn’t just, oh, it was fucking hilarious. The level of shameless Hanson goes to with his cameos gained a lot of attention. After a video started circulating around where he is endorsing a new product called the Escobar flipped to a foldable smartphone released by Pablo Escobar’s, actual brother, Roberto Escobar, former chief of assassinations for the Escobar drug cartel. He literally accepted $50 to endorse a company owned by a mass murderer.

(22m 57s):
Hey guys, Chris Hanson here of Hanson versus predators and to catch a predator. I just wanted to tell you all that I’ve seen this amazing new smartphone called the Escobar fold two. It appears to be the best phone out right now. I’ve been looking at the transcripts, so have a seat, check it out and remember I’ll be watching, take care. It just, it just doesn’t seem real. It doesn’t seem real like it’s so beyond the pale, like we have whatever the Rubicon is. We are so far past it. We’re about to cross another one. Yup. And the whole thing is really unreal because not only is it that not only, not only is it Pablo Escobar’s brother, there’s no way of obfuscating.

(23m 42s):
It. There’s no way of plausible deniability, this personally murdered and then sign, you know, instructed the murder of probably literally in the tens of thousands of people. He’s a mass murderer. And Chris Hanson endorsed a phone company that he started for for $50 and even worse. The entire thing was a literal theft scam. The company was created using drug money. And what they did was bought a bunch of Samsung flip phones, painted them gold and added the Escobar logo over the top of all the Samsung logos. The way that we learned that was that a bunch of YouTubers and tech reviewers that had been sent the phones.

(24m 24s):
Notably Marcus Browley had become suspicious because they got the phone and they were like, this looks exactly like the Samsung flip phone. And there’s a lot of phones and computers that are like, that are knockoffs that are, that, that are fairly identical to a name brand phone. You know, there’s like knockoff, iPhones and knockoff, Samsung phones and things like that. But they were even more suspicious because the phone cost $400. That’s significantly cheaper than the Samsung flip phone. And the S the phone seemed identical and functionality. So they were like, how is this possible? How are they selling it for this? So they actually started digging around on the phone and pulling off decals and logos.

(25m 6s):
And they discovered that they were literally Samsung flip phones that had just been painted. It wasn’t a knockoff. It wasn’t, it wasn’t a clone that was built in some warehouse. It was just, they took the phone and painted it. They offered them for $400 on the website, which seemed like a great deal compared to the 1500 that the identical Samsung flip cost, they sent a bunch of these fake phones out to crappy low rent, YouTube tech reviewers to look at. And then anybody else who actually bought a phone from the website had their money stolen and never actually received a phone after they’d made enough money from the scam. They deleted the website and disappears. They bought like whatever they bought a hundred Samsung flips or whatever the number was, they painted them. They added these logos.

(25m 46s):
They sent those out to you tubers. The YouTubers started reviewing them. And you know, some of the re YouTubers with more integrity like Marcus, Browley like, they were like, this is a fucking scam, but some of the lower hanging fruit, you tech reviewers, they actually gave them positive reviews. Cause they just, they were like, this phone works. Cause it was a, it was a Samsung phone. And then people bought the phone on the website based on this promotional campaign. And then they just took all the money. Chris Hansen actively helped Pablo Escobar’s murderer brother run a phishing scam. And if you see some of the footage surrounding this, everything about it is unreal.

(26m 28s):
They, they, they did like a promotional thing. Like they were interviewed by some news organization or whatever. And Roberto Escobar is like talking about, he’s like, yes, I’ve always loved technology. And I just thought that I could make better technology than other people. And the way saying is like, this guy knows nothing about anything. He’s just speaking. It’s like the Sophia Stewart thing where he’s pretending like he’s an expert, but he doesn’t know enough about it to be able to speak like an expert. So it’s, it’s transparent to anybody listening to him that he literally knows nothing about it. And then they cut to like the guy who’s the supposedly CTO of the company. Who’s this random Swedish guy. And he’s like, I’m here doing this stuff.

(27m 8s):
We had the Pablo Escobar and his brother, his brother rubber. He literally says, we’re going to be where we are becoming the new Steve jobs. That’s what he says sounds about. Right. And it’s obviously some weird hired actor. It’s so fucking weird. I love it. You’d seriously. Think Chris Hanson would have stopped doing cameo or at least started heavily vetting the requests. He fulfilled after finding out he literally endorsed a phishing scam by a drug kingpins brother, but he’s still doing it to this day. Anybody got a phishing scam. He’ll literally help you run it right now for $50. And just to go back to our cameo real quick, aside from it being hilarious, another reason why I wanted to do it, and the reason why I wanted to feature it in this episode and kind of get this weird fake out at the beginning of the episode, that made it seem like he was going to be a guest on the show is because I, I just really wanted to hammer the point home of like, whatever your opinion on Chris Hanson is up to this point.

(28m 6s):
Whether or not you believe these things, which it’s all true. I don’t know how you wouldn’t be able to believe him, or if you just don’t think it’s a big deal. If you think so far, nothing we’ve said on this episode, on these, on these episodes, ruins him for you. And you still think like don’t care, he’s great comedy aside or how funny it was aside. Don’t you think it’s a little troublesome and problematic that somebody who’s supposed to be, who’s supposed to stand for objective journalism. And it’s supposed to be the person who is bringing us fair and balanced news and is supposed to stand for all of these various tenants of integrity in reporting information can be bought for $50 to endorse a podcast and call himself a con man.

(28m 54s):
Don’t you think that there’s something a little troublesome about that because I do, aside from it being funny, it’s very shocking that an Emmy-winning news journalist who helped bring down a crack den and busted up a child trafficking ring and helped arrest 300 pedophiles will say whatever you want for $50 without thinking about it. That worries me a little bit, that, you know, you have people out there who are so trusted, so accepted as this source of information and that they can be bought and sold that easily. Another really weird thing about his cameos is how he shamelessly uses his T cap catchphrases have a seat right over there, or I’ll be watching and listening.

(29m 40s):
He fires off the phrases in the same way that a Donald Trump impersonator would say you’re fired to a accruing group of middle-aged soccer moms on a weekend trip to Vegas. It’s so weird to me that he uses phrases that he employed in hard-hitting takedowns of pedophiles as his fun catch phrases. He says to delight his fans, we didn’t even ask him to say, I’ll be watching and listening in the video he made for us. He just added that in on his own. It seemed that Hanson had pretty much given up on the idea of continuing to do investigations for YouTube. And he just full on becomes a spokesperson for shady scam bullshit. He participated in another thinly veiled product endorsement interview for a series of classes called scam report, which is run by John Crestani.

(30m 20s):
It’s a pyramid scheme to sell his shitty group book. The book is supposed to be about how to protect yourself from scams, but it is a scam. You also endorsed another scam called debt relief secrets, a book on how to reduce your debt. The book is by Anthony Seren, Draya, another scam artist guru. These two things. If you look into them like, you know, go, go look them up, look up John Crestani or, or Anthony Sarandrea or scam report or Def debt relief, secrets they’re pyramid schemes. And Chris Hanson did a series of endorsements for them like, like a, like a whole special where he like sits down and interviews. John Crestani. And it’s so weird too, because it’s like, why would Chris Hanson be doing this? They’re capitalizing off of the iconography of Chris Hansen where it’s like, he’s having a seat with John Crestani.

(31m 4s):
But the iconography of it is implying. If you map that onto Chris Hansen’s career and what he did, it’s like implying that John Crestani is a predator or he’s in the position of a predator. It’s so weird. People play into this weird punning of Chris Hanson’s career. And so it’s like, they’re more than happy to be like, oh, I’m having a seat with Chris Hanson. You shouldn’t want to have a seat with Chris Hanson. The people that had a seat with Chris Hanson we’re pedophiles. Why would you do that? It’s so weird to put yourself in that position from a branding perspective, but he’s famous. That’s exactly. They’re just like It’s famous. All contexts melts away in his baby blue shark eyes.

(31m 46s):
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(32m 30s):
Get the comfort you deserve from Griffith energy services and carrier visit Griffith energy services.com today for this and other exclusive offers. That’s Griffith energy.com, license Number empty HB ACR zero one dash 2, 2 7 8 Griffith energy services. I just love Chris Hansen, Chris Hanson, take me into your, your secret dark den of iniquity and scam artists. I mean, we, we could, we could launch a pretty good pyramid scheme. We’ve already, we already have an audience. Scott, get Chrissy ham, hands on board, and we could be, we can be selling these people pamphlets by tomorrow. I hear that Hillsboro is Dan drift, cures male pattern baldness.

(33m 14s):
Yes, actually I took Hillsboro dandruff, and I now look like cousin. It, it grew hair all over my body. It’s actually kind of annoying, but you know, just take a little less, I guess he then got paid $10,000 to start in an attack ad on a woman named Valerie. Plame running for Congress in New Mexico, accused of being an anti-Semite, but then she turned out to be Jewish herself. I guess she did actually say some problematic things that we won’t go into here. But the ultimate point is that somebody was like, here’s $10,000. Say this lady hates Jews and your teacup voice. And he was like, okay, I won’t check into this at all. My name is Valerie Plame Valerie. Plame. I’m going to need you to have a seat right over there.

(33m 57s):
She promoted material from a racist hate site at least nine times. And you won’t believe what she’s doing now. I’m running for Congress. Congress, did you just wake up in the morning and say, I’m going to share a racist website at least nine times. I just want to spread some hate. Oh, well write it. There’s been lots written recently. Chris Hanson, hating Jews. Isn’t cool. That’s literally what it is. Literally after Hansen’s seemingly cashed in, on every scam and grift, he could find, he finally got called back to the Annecy on case for one last hurrah. When out of the blue and ECN agreed to do a sit-down interview with Hansen.

(34m 39s):
However, an ECN wanted to do the interview on his channel. And perhaps because of old man technical incompetence, or perhaps as a purposeful evasion tactic Hanson claimed that wanted to do the interview on his only fans page and rejected it on the grounds of refusing to appear on a porn site. And I can’t even, I can’t even convey that in this copy. So I’ll have to explain it like, cause it makes no sense. Oh, Nissan was like, I’ll do the interview, come onto my channel and we’ll do it. He said nothing about only fans, but then in a response video, Chris Hanson was like, I’m not doing it because I’m not going to go on to a porn site. I literally don’t even know why he thinks that he it’s never explained. Nobody can explain why he thought he was asking him to go onto his only fans.

(35m 23s):
It’s so weird. It makes it’s just so confusing. I mean, is that just him? Is that just, is the reason that he’s saying that almost. He’s just saying that because it’s an excuse not to let onesie on monetize the video because Hanson wanted monetize the video. That’s my only explanation is that he purposely was just saying that to get out of it because otherwise it doesn’t make sense. He never see, never suggested only fans. He never mentioned only fans in response to this onesie on agreed to do the interview on Hanson’s channel with one stipulation. The interview has to be demonetized on his channel, Hanson refuses, but then 30 minutes later, caves due to fan backlash and agrees to de monetize the video Hanson and his team say the interview needs to be prerecorded, even though he does all of his interviews live and ECN agrees as long as he can simultaneously live, stream it on his channel.

(36m 11s):
So nothing can be taken out of context. Hanson refuses some context for this. There’s actually a very large community of so-called commentary YouTubers on YouTube. And it’s basically this big community of people who make long, 30 minute hour long videos talking about these things. They’ll make an hour long video talking about and this alleged thing he did, or this new advancement in the on story or interviewing one of his victims. So this thing that Chris Hanson is doing is actually very common on the channel. And it’s a bunch of young kids doing this. It’s it’s like 22 year olds with channels where they make these long videos talking about how problematic Shane Dawson is or the horrible things that Jeffrey star has done.

(36m 58s):
It’s part of their agreed upon protocol that whenever they do a really serious video, where they sit down and interview a victim or a survivor about their story, it’s a sign of respect and a common part of what they do, that they will de monetize those videos. That’s just the thing that they do. And they, they sort of say it in the, in the video, there’ll be like, you know, and just to let you know, this video has been demonetized, not making any money off of it, or, or sometimes they even donate the money to charity or whatever. In that context it’s specifically agregious that Chris Hanson was like, no, like I wanna, I’m gonna make money from this. So you got a lot of backlash from that Hanson claims. He doesn’t want an ECE on live streaming at simultaneously because he doesn’t want him exploiting the interview for views and money, even though he’s exploiting it for views.

(37m 39s):
And also initially refuse to demand it As the video, but really it feels like he wants to be able to cut up the interview and take things out of content And having the full interview live stream doesn’t play into his manipulation tactics, or he’s scared that a Nissan will make a fool of him and wants to Be able to control what the audience sees eventually Annecy on finally caves completely and agrees to do the interview prerecorded with Hanson without wide streaming. But for some reason they still refuse. It makes absolutely no sense. And just like the only fan Thing, nobody can explain this and it’s never been acknowledged, but after this back and forth on easy on finally said, fine prerecorded on your channel.

(38m 21s):
It will not be live. Why channel whatever. I don’t even care if you monetize the video, fuck it. And then they just didn’t do it. And they never explained why You think that’s Chris Hanson not wanting a definitive period at the end of that sentence. So he can, I wanted to pursue him. He wanted him to refuse. He wanted to have this drawn out thing of trying to get him to do the interview, chasing the white whale. He didn’t want to actually do the interview because what the fuck is he going to say? He doesn’t know anything about this case. All he’s done is interviewed people and been like, it’s horrible. What he did. He has no insight into the case. He is a reporter. He has no specific insights into these things.

(39m 4s):
He’s just a face. So when he has these, when you conduct these interviews, his questions suck because he’s not being backed by a huge news corporation in the wake of this mess. Hanson started being heavily criticized for bundling up the interview in response to the criticism. He literally just tweeted a picture of his Emmy with no caption. Dude has just straight up lost touch with reality. I kind of love that though. I kind of love him just being like what, what, I’m a YouTube person who’s barely scraping by. And I’ve hired a sexual predator to be a lawyer to work with me. Why then let go. And I had this guy who was working for me and then I a puddle, let him go because he was a racist, but fuck it.

(39m 47s):
I got an Emmy. There’s some stuff I want to talk about in regards to that in the discussion portion. I mean the discussion trilogy of episodes. Yes, but I have some specific thoughts on Hanson’s credentials versus all these other YouTubers who are criticizing him and kind of some of the complexities of that. And then pretty much the most exploitative thing he’s done to date comes out. It’s discovered that Hanson is attempting to sell the Annecy on story to investigation discovery, to create a legit investigation, new, special around it. Fans, critics, and the victims. The interview are understandably confused and live it. First of all, he is taking all of these victims and survivors that agreed to come on a show and capitalizing off of their stories without their permission. And the whole thing is extremely exploitative.

(40m 28s):
Plus Hanson doesn’t even have anything to do with the story. He’s just inserting himself into it. Also, you can’t sell a story like this. He doesn’t own life rights. And none of the story happened to him. All he can sell is his part of the story, which is I did a bunch of zoom calls with women and ask them dumb questions after the backlash Hanson backpedal on the entire affair and tried to play it off, like he was never attempting to sell the story, but was rather just opening up a dialogue about possibilities for investigation of discovery, to help amplify the voice of the survivors. At this point, he moves on from a Nissan completely though. He does randomly mention him from time to time and promise to continue updating about his quote unquote investigation and sets his sights on another burgeoning news story of victims coming forward about a celebrity predator, grooming them at a young age.

(41m 13s):
He officially starts investigating the lead singer of mid two thousands. MySpace banned blood on the dance floor. Davi vanity Began circulating in 2009 about the misconduct happening both on and off stage for fans of Dobby vanity. That name is so hard to say, DAPI, vanity, vanity, Davi, vanity grinding on underage fans. It being photographed open mouth, kissing them and making some of the most sexually explicit comments directed towards them that you could possibly imagine. You used to have fans throw their bras on stage. And there’s a video where he picks one up and comments that it’s a hello kitty bra, which could only possibly belong to a pre-teen girl.

(41m 53s):
Over the years, he was accused of sexual assault by several former fans who claimed he had either sexually harassed or even forced them into sexual acts with him as young as 12 years old in March of 2020, the stories and accusations really started to bubble over and many women were coming forward with their accounts of being victimized by Dobby Hanson started out by interviewing Blair white, the same political commentator and survivor advocate from the case, as well as Ashley Lilly. One of vanity’s most egregious victims who at the age of 13 ingratiated himself with her mom as a sort of mentor slash father figure for Ashley staying the night at her house while she was having a sleep over with a friend, he snuck into her bedroom at night, encouraged the two 13 year old girls to kiss in front of him and joined the kiss.

(42m 41s):
And later forced Ashley into performing oral sex On him. And once again, just like the NAC on story, that’s a little brief description of a truly horrific story that I just don’t want to get into here because you know, this isn’t a, this isn’t a true crime podcast. I’ve listened to a lot of true crime podcasts, but I’m not necessarily unless it’s completely necessary to do. And it’s really germane to the story. I don’t want to go into detail of explaining these horrific things. If you, if you’re interested in finding out more about that, there’s plenty of content about it on YouTube. Several more women reach out to Hansen, wanting to come onto a show and tell their stories. It’s a whole new set of people who probably aren’t particularly aware of the Annecy on drama. So they don’t yet know how ineffective Hanson is at actually assisting in these situations.

(43m 25s):
Hanson promised he had connections at the FBI and he could get a case started for this. However, he kept stringing them along, not delivering results and ghosting them. Finally, they ended up taking it upon themselves and got in contact with the FBI without him completely independent of Hansen’s help. A few other women actually got in contact with an FBI agent, and there’s now an open investigation into vanities misconduct. At first, Ashley really believed Hanson could help the case and ended up becoming his assistant of sorts, working for free, reaching out to guests, emailing and messaging people staying up until 6:00 AM every night working to get survivors on handsome show. It drove a rift between her and her fiance. It emotionally exhausted her. She was having constant anxiety and panic attacks.

(44m 5s):
Yeah. We talked that day. He ended up or we ended up being on the phone and I was so upset because this girl, I felt so bad for her because she was just crying on the phone with me. And she was so uncomfortable and she was so young and just so small. And I just, I felt so bad for her. And I was like crying on the phone with him because I’m like, I’m watching this girl be used by him right now. And like, we have to do something like where, what can we do to help her? And he told that, you know, we’ll find out where she lives. And he probably, this is like literally verbatim. He’s like, I probably have connections in law enforcement out there from when I was on the show. So find out where she lives and tell me, and then I’ll see what I can do. I told her like, listen, like, we’re going to figure it out.

(44m 46s):
Like we got this, don’t worry about it. Like, we’ll get this taken care of. And when Dobie was calling this girl, he was asking to see her bedroom. Like he was asking her to show her entire room to him so that he would know if she had a camera anywhere. If there was anybody else in the room, recording the conversations before he would proceed and asking her of sexual favors. So I, me and her came up with a game plan where she was going to have an iPad or something, or have her phone up somewhere that he couldn’t see. And then I would report it for her. So I would be screen recording their call for her. So he didn’t get like any notifications that were screenshotting or screen reporting. Cause he does this all through Instagram, Instagram video calls. Yeah. So you get notifications. I at least I think you get notifications, but either way she was we’re figuring that out.

(45m 28s):
I kept asking Chris like, because she, she was really scared to go through with it. So me and her kept kind of going back and forth like, okay, well we’ll do it this time. We’ll do it this time. So I kept asking him, you know, like what have you heard anything? Cause this girl he’s still calling her. Like she was sending me screenshots where he’s calling her literally 30 times a day. There’s 36 year old man was FaceTiming a 16 year old girl, 30 times a day. And she, they were like talking through text or through messengers, send each other pictures, just like regular photos of themselves. And I kept sending them or I kept telling him about it on the phone. And I was like, Hey, when, when can we hear, when did you hear back from somebody? Like, when can we do something about this? And it was just like, I will, soon. I will.

(46m 8s):
Soon I have this year. I’m waiting on hearing back from somebody else. I’m waiting on this. I’m waiting on that. And then two weeks go by and this girl FaceTimes me again. And we’re like, okay, you know what, fuck it. We’re not going to wait for Chris Hanson. We’re just going to do this now. So I looked up the laws, I’m like recording phone calls and everything. And they said, as long as the person is doing something illegal it’s okay. So like, all right, cool. We’re good. And we started setting everything up and then mid call with this girl. She realizes that Dobby has blocked her because he got suspicious because she wasn’t sending him pictures anymore. We lost the ability for anything. Yeah. He just kept putting it off. And that one particular just sucks so bad because it’s like, I was watching this young girl, like fall apart and like blame herself.

(46m 49s):
And like she wanted to help so bad. And then we just lost. Eventually she lost faith in Hanson and decided to cut ties with him completely. Once again, Hanson saw himself burning bridges with everyone involved in this case, as he slowly revealed to them that a, he was really only in it for the views and the money and B despite his reputation, he kind of completely sucked at doing his job as happened with the onesie on case the final straw for anyone still rooting for Hanson occurred when he interviewed Jeffrey star, a highly controversial makeup blogger and business owner who was embroiled in several of his own controversies, but who knew and was friends with Davi vanity for years, since they came from the same town, the interview was criticized because a, everyone hates Jeffrey and he has proven himself to be an absolute why or an opportunist and B, because he told several egregious lies throughout the interview, enhancing didn’t take him to task at all.

(47m 37s):
Like an actual journalist should. So here he is a man without a town shunned from the anesthesia and victim advocacy community on the verge of being shunned by the Davi vanity victim advocacy community. As the stories of his exploits of incompetence, start to drift further and further out of the orbit of just the YouTube community. He started to become outed as a sham to the greater public. And it seems like anytime he even makes a single tweet, he gets 10 hour long videos from YouTube is calling him out on his every mistake at worst. His interview, quote unquote, investigations are openly damaging to the ongoing cases. He’s pretending to want to help such as the Jeffrey star interview the way he goes to Ashley about getting in contact with the FBI or the time you took a key piece of evidence in the OTC on case and rendered it inadmissible in court at best.

(48m 21s):
His interviews are completely pointless waste of time. That seemed to literally have no purpose whatsoever, such as this time that he interviewed the insane clown posse about Davi vanity. For some reason, Talented guys who are socially conscious and trying to do a lot of great things right now. You came out Jesse of the day and I have so many questions. I don’t even know where to start. I’ve been doing this for 40 years, but I’m very excited to have you guys here. You called that event. Hey, Sue’s Torres Juggalos enemy. Number one. How did he get on your radar? And why did you decide to speak out in a way that has created so much attention to this? I mean, he came on our radar through your show.

(49m 2s):
You know, I honestly, we want, you know, I, you know, the old soul to catch a predator. That’s my all time favorite show of all time. And I remember the funny thing was I, my son, I believe was 13 at the time. He’s 15 now. And, and I said, but I want to show you this really cool show come here. And I I’ve loaded it up on YouTube. And he’s like, oh, Chris Hanson dev to catch a predator. And I’m like, yeah, you already know this. And he’s like, yeah. And I was like, hell yeah. But we made a song called the, a predator, the warmup for the show. It’s a very, of course that was inspired by you.

(49m 44s):
You know? So yeah. We, we, you know, we, we, we were huge fans. I mean, we we’d follow your career, you know, we just really admire you. And, but what, what it was about this particular guy, this particular investigation is of course it hits so close to home for us because technically this guy is, he does the exact same thing for living. We do. Yeah. Right. But so is a, is a rare profession. I mean, it’s not like everybody does this. You don’t say it’s a rare job. It’s not rare. Whatever the word is, see you need jobs, you know? So this guy is doing exactly what we do.

(50m 25s):
I totally get it. Was he, you knew In the music industry? No, no, not at all. Wait, what you don’t understand is this man it’s, it’s like our whole career. We we’ve been totally against any kind of pedophiles or touching children loudly speaking about our whole career and our music and our music. Right. Not just like outspoken about it, looking at interviews, but in songs and our music, you know, it, it goes back to the beginning of our music career. And you know, so obviously when we found out about Dobby, Dobby, pedophile, boy, you know what I’m saying? We could just sit there and not say nothing.

(51m 6s):
It was, you know, it’s just like, come on, man. He’s doing okay. They’re in full on makeup. Yup. They’re in the full, insane clown, posse makeup or the men to me. You’ve never, you’ve never heard insane clown posse in your life. You told us to do this. The conversation is just so off in another stratosphere, I was listening to it in the world of the show. It’s quite something I’ve been doing this 40 years.

(51m 48s):
And I’ve never once had asked someone where do magnets come from? How do they work shaggy to joke? Can you enlighten us? Well, you know, like I learned about magnets from watching you because you were talking about magnets. And I was like, damn, I use magnets every day. And I didn’t even think about how they worked. And you opened my eyes to that. And I was, I had my son, I called my son and I was like, yo son, come in here. I need to show you this dope thing about this thing that Chris Hanson was showing me.

(52m 28s):
And my son looked at it and he was like, oh yeah, magnets. And I was like, you know about magnets. I love that. I love that. They’re just like, yeah, man, that thing you did 20 years ago, we were really fucking big fans, man. We just loved that shit. Like you’re the reason we became musicians, bro. We saw you talking to those fucking rapists. And we were like, yeah, let’s put on the clown makeup and starts singing about family, family. Yeah. And ninjas don’t they think about ninjas. Yeah. They say ninjas instead of the inward. Oh my God. They replace anywhere where you would say that with ninja instead.

(53m 9s):
Wow. I feel like we need to do a deep cuts all about, we probably should. It’s it’s a, it’s a crazy story. I mean the whole, just the Juggalo thing, like just, and I couldn’t it come out that they’re actually, they were still Christians this whole time. There’s a lot of stuff about them. I mean, they’re like, th there’s like this weird religious element of it. And like, they were kind of like a joke for a while, but then they kind of actually got some, they actually got some respect in the community because they basically went and staged like a counter protest to like a bunch of white supremacists Trump supporters that were protesting in Washington and stuff like that. And I was in, I was in Maryland. When that happened, you were in the Juggalo. I was at clan winter in Arizona where I’m from.

(53m 52s):
Yeah, there’s a juggle. You don’t know my life. There’s a big, there’s a big, I mean, you know, but for listeners, there’s a huge community of Juggalos in Arizona where you’re from New Mexico, where I’m from, and also in Bakersfield, California, where I lived for many years, some of my best friends are Juggalos, hang out best friends. But I know a lot of people who are Juggalos are really, really nice people. This is not a joke, Dave, my brother is a Juggalo Within the first few minutes of the interview, ICP reveals that they don’t know anything about the case other than what they’ve seen in Chris Hanson’s videos. So he’s interviewing people, attempting to get new information about this ongoing case who literally learned everything they know about it from him on fucking real.

(54m 44s):
At least we got this promo where Chris Hanson, not only utters the hilarious catchphrase, Juggalos beyond call, but also pronounces ICP members chalky to dopes name. And that was dad way humanly possible Is our investigation into Dobby. Vanity continues. The music industry is speaking out loudly about the 10 year history of sexual assault allegations in grooming our guests tomorrow night, Wednesday Eastern violin, J shaggy two dope, insane clown posse. Lot as they have a seat with Chris Hanson, check it out. Juggalos call Listening to insane policy in the background.

(55m 32s):
I Actually, I actually ho I w I want to believe it. Alternate read of this situation where he actually genuinely is a huge ICP fan and has been for years. Andrew, Andrew, Andrew shaggy two dope, violent J and shaggy two dope. He’s he’s just he’s. He’s the dad. He’s the pro he’s the Uber dad docile, Uber fossa. Shaggy two dope. I can’t get over shaggy to death. We’ve been here for nine hours and I don’t think anything will come even close.

(56m 11s):
Nothing to shaggy shaggy two dope. It’s so funny. It’s you can’t write it. You can’t write it to dope. He has no insight into this situation. Literally has never heard of it before, but I’m going to ask the probing questions that you want to know. I’m literally Only doing this because insane clown posse have a large cult following, and I’m trying to get internet. I’m Chris Hanson. Welcome to clout chaser. Grandpa edition my guests today, violent J and shaggy.

(56m 58s):
Do you think that we could get sued if I just change my name to shaggy two dope. And it’s like I’m Dave baker and I’m shaggy two dope. The real question is what do we have to do to get the in sound being on clown policy? What do we have to do to get the insane clown posse on the show? It gave me that hard. They’re trying to hang out with fucking insane. Clown posse, Dave baker, I’m injured price and I’m shaggy two dope says he calls himself, oh God, I don’t even know where to go.

(57m 56s):
I don’t know how we come back from shaggy two dope. You can’t write any of this. Do they have a record label? Like, are all those other clown bands? Like, are they on there? It’s real weird. The, the, the, the relationship between them as a band, the iconography and sort of the Canon that they have, and then like how that extends to both the community that they have, as well as their record label, as well as other bands. So like ICP is the originator of all of the Juggalo shit. It’s all con it all comes from them. They created all of it. It’s all mythology within their band. But then other people who are fans of ICP are Juggalos.

(58m 36s):
So it’s like if deep cuts fans started dressing up in like red sweatshirts with colored shirts underneath and sort of pretending like they were like boy detectives or whatever, and then a huge community grew out of it. And then they had conventions and festivals and things. Sometimes ICP does perform with them and sometimes they don’t even perform with them. They’re they’re not even involved in it. It’s just like, if a bunch of rolling stones fans just like went in, like had a hangout session together, partied on a giant compound and live bands played. That kind of sounded like rolling stones, but rolling stones actually had nothing to do with it. And they didn’t actually go, they didn’t play and they didn’t even know existed. And then also there’s other bands who are also Juggalos.

(59m 18s):
So they’re like people who are fans of who were started out as of ICP And they were Juggalos, but then they started bands and then they became, they got record labels or they signed with ICP record label. And then they’re just a different band who also capitalizes off of the iconography of Juggalos. So like twisted, there’s a band called twisted and they’re Juggalos, but they’re not affiliated with ICP. I mean, they are their friends and they, I think they’re on the record label, but they’re a different band, but they’re also Juggalos. I love it converting. I don’t need to my, I don’t have a brother.

(59m 57s):
I’ll I’ll play this though. Oh my God. Did you, did your brother make music? Did he make juggle a music? Dave, Dave, your brother made juggle music. Dave behave. Oh my God. What is happening right now? I’m so tense. I feel like I’m about to get ambushed Raised in Roswell.

(1h 0m 42s):
It’s small, but it’s , but I guess to have much love for the civil those out there, I wish as your competitors, as ours, we have tons of love of the Juggalos. We’re going to be hot. Was that your brother? I don’t understand. Does he not understand how rhythm works? There’s not a single word. You can recognize in that entire thing, other than born and raised in Roswell, nothing. And then Charles would ever fucking die.

(1h 1m 27s):
I don’t understand anything I just heard, but I love it. And I want him to have a record deal and I need to know his fucking Juggalos. I forget what it was yet. He had like a weird rap group with our cousin who they, they just wrapped over like existing beats. And I know that they were called schizophrenia killers, but I can’t remember what his name was. You remember your cousin’s name? No, I used to, I used to know both their names. I was like, I would like, I would always like listen to all their music and like keep up to date with the exploits of sick schizophrenia killers. And I can’t remember what their names were.

(1h 2m 7s):
Oh shit. It’s schizo frantic. Kilo’s ah, ah, Yeti. But I have to agree with him. Me too, Man. What would you do in this? Your prints, your digital photos directly onto glass making your favorite moments come alive in vivid color hand, assembled in the USA. Fractured glass prints are a unique and beautiful way to display and share your favorite moments. Simply upload your photo at fracture. me.com select your size and your glass print will be shipped to you. Ready to hang with just one screw use code pod 15 to get 15% off your order today.

(1h 2m 51s):
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(1h 3m 33s):
Learn more@gorecycle.org brought to you by prince William county, district of Columbia and American disposal services Gracefully bow out and retire from the armchair YouTube predator catching business, acknowledge your damaging role in this situation so far and ask for guidance and how you can improve yourself and do better in the future. Did anybody have any money on actively start working with an anonymous member to strategically docs all of your enemies, but pretend like you had nothing to do with it? Yeah, I mean, either around this time, an unknown YouTube account called anonymous gene or gene anonymous or any of the many different handles he created as a counselor, systematically band starts popping up in the burning embers of the T cap community.

(1h 4m 17s):
He openly condemns anybody who is critical of Chris Hanson and essentially becomes this new attack dog. If you make fun of Hanson anonymous, gene is going to come after you. Gene starts threatening that he is a next level internet hacker, and is going to start releasing the private information of many key figures in the onesie on and Davi vanity cases. And he makes good on his promise in a stunning show of his abilities, anonymous gene DOCSIS on Nissan’s entire family, parents, siblings, et cetera, releasing their full names, phone numbers, and home addresses. You also does the same for John Swan, a YouTuber who was one of the first to release an expos on Hanson’s history of bad reporting and incompetence in the onesie on and Davi vanity cases, rumors start to fly about anonymous. Jean, who is he?

(1h 4m 58s):
Is he actually working with Chris Hanson? Some people think he’s Vincent Nakota. Some people think he might even be Hanson himself. However, was most the YouTuber who was previously docs by Vincent and had horrible racist slurs. Hurled at him was able to talk to anonymous gene and get some fairly illuminating information from a chat reenacted here on his YouTube channel with a use of the real Slim, shady by M and M as background music that I will never understand. Let’s talk. I have a little bit of a platform now, and I would like to share your side of the story You want to share the story of a mechanic turned anonymous. I am deeply honored. I thought you were Vince. You have seen the issues I have with him and he plays games, Not Vincent Eugene.

(1h 5m 45s):
Again, I am a retired mechanic. Ask me anything about a car. Yes. I believe you. I know you are not Vincent. Your spelling was the first giveaway. And then when you prove technical ability, I knew you were not him. So what can I help you with? Can I send you some questions? Do you want to do an audio interview or should I just send them here? You may send them here. I do not allow my voice to be recorded. I am worried your account will be gone again. I will need about 20 minutes and then send them here. The reason I was losing accounts was I was spamming 6,000 messages a day.

(1h 6m 25s):
This one should hold. I am not spamming with it Other than being a retired mechanic. What else can you tell me about your background? How did you acquire your technical skills and what led you to this path of internet justice? I’m really not down for an interview. If you had questions about the cake, What can you tell me about Chris Hanson’s role in the investigation? Do you expect that we will see onesie on and Kai behind bars anytime soon, will Chris be able to get Sarah’s laptop to the FBI so they can finally go through it? It is a transition time right now, many questions you asked cannot be answered right now. Chris’s role. He’s a predator catcher.

(1h 7m 7s):
They both will be in jail sometime soon, Obviously passionate about this case and in contact with Chris, did you seek him out to help? I owed him a favor, nothing more. So your goal is not to be platform. Any predator in particular, will you stay on after onesie on his jail to assist with further apprehensions? No, I am doing this for Chris. So then he can go after the dark net predators. I really am here to help him with the dark net, but one project at a time. Can I ask your thoughts on Vince? Do you believe he was going to damage the case Chris’s fighting for? And can you explain more about the dark net predators? Are these the sex traffickers? We hear so much about that.

(1h 7m 47s):
The authorities seem unable to stop because of a lack of resources and know-how How would it damage it? If the FBI was investigating before Chris was involved, the dark net is not something that can be put into simple sentences. It would take hours to explain enough. So you could understand it just enough to go. Where did I put myself through that? You were asking law enforcement officers to go after dark net predators, like asking a McDonald’s employee to pilot, Falcon heavy. I agreed people keep telling Me that what I was doing would harm the investigation. And I knew that was not accurate. Well, crispy going after people like that or anyone in particular or is it just a blow the lid on the dark web General?

(1h 8m 27s):
I cannot tell them yet, but it will be every manner of pedophile. You could imagine. Mostly for places as magic kingdom, boy lest hurt Matt and others. Why was the text release tonight? Write your story with some ethics that we will see. Okay. Understood. Is there one final thing you could tell me that would ease people’s mind who are now doubting the investigations? I could find the police report that mentions it, but I am sure you could find it just as easy I did, but so many people have poked holes in it that people are doubting it in lieu of that. What is the overall message you would like to relay? You can link it right from the Pierce county website message.

(1h 9m 8s):
We are anonymous. We are Legion. We do not forgive. We do not forget no issues. I am a short-tempered asshole. My apologies. You can use anything we have discussed Before you go. Do you have any other texts you can week or will it have to wait until if and when you decide to it will be delivered straight, no funny shit or twisting your words. So it wasn’t Vincent. It seemingly wasn’t anybody. Just some random guy who had stayed loyal to Hanson throughout all of his exploits, YouTubers started doing digging, and also discovered that apparently anonymous gene wasn’t a new development in Hansen’s life. He’d actually been working with him since, at least back when Hanson attempted to confront an ECE on at his house. It was discovered that gene had actually been the one to leak.

(1h 9m 50s):
The first footage of Chris standing outside of a Nissan’s house. And Hanson had apparently sent him the video on purpose so that he could quote unquote, leak it to the public. He did the same thing with a screenshot of Vincent saying the inward during west most chat with him. He sent him a screenshot that showed Hansen, sending him the screenshot of Vincent saying the inward and subtly implying that he should leak it to the public. How far down does this rabbit hole go? So now this is kind of serious. Chris Hanson is no longer just simply accused of being a shitty reporter and advocate for victims of underage sexual assault. He’s actually being accused of working directly with an internet hacker, instructing him to dox people as revenge for criticizing him in a video, addressing the anonymous gene allegations, Hanson claims to not know who Jean is and to never have worked with him.

(1h 10m 34s):
He also claims to completely disavowed doxing into never have participated in or endorsed it in any way. However, floods have direct evidence that neither of these things are true. Started turning up in one screenshot of a social media interaction. Hanson responds to a comment or asking if gene worked for Hanson by saying he’s responsible for his own actions he worked with, not for. So he did at least work with him in another screenshot at social media posts, somebody enhancements, Facebook group comments saying, Hey, Chris, I hope you see this emails, links that involve you Vincent at a hacker. I’m pretty sure it’s a fake and it’s not really you, but you need to address the situation and clear your name.

(1h 11m 14s):
Hope You’re doing okay to which Hansen replied, show it to Jean, please. That seems to imply a much closer way. Show it to Jean. Please Types anything on like a Facebook comment or anything like that. He says it out loud to himself in the Chris Hanson voice. That seems to imply a much closer relationship than Hanson and suggesting the most damning evidence actually comes from Hanson himself in a video on his YouTube channel, where he’s addressing a situation on Twitter. He shows a screenshot from his phone that shows him being blocked by some random Twitter account. However, in the screenshot, you can see his menu panel of options. The menu you get when you’re being asked, if you want to share an image with your contact, airdrop it or email it, et cetera.

(1h 11m 59s):
And in the panel of the contacts he texts with most frequently above his own two sons, chase and Connor in texting frequency is anonymous. Gene. He literally just has him in his contacts as anonymous gene in terms of his disavowment of doxing. Well, another YouTuber critical of Hanson’s work creep show art, who actually was the one who helped secure the FBI agent to open up a case against Davi vanity decided to run her own cat fishing scheme. She emailed Mike Morris, the scumbag lawyer that Hanson is partner with posing as a T cap fanatic claiming to have private personal information such as phone numbers and addresses of some of the key YouTubers who have been openly criticizing Hansen. So if Hansen’s hard stance against doxing is that he disavows it wants nothing to do with it and refuses to engage in it whatsoever.

(1h 12m 42s):
Then the obvious response to this email would either be no response or a polite, sorry. We do not accept information like that as it’s highly illegal and unethical. So what did Morse respond with? Send anything over that you have and I’ll forward it to Chris. Yeah, it wasn’t Hansen directly, but somebody a sensibly representing Hansen’s organization openly agreed to accept doc’s information. So let’s look at a checklist so far in this career. Hanson has gotten an innocent kid who was working for the FBI to bust up a crack den, condemned to life on the streets, and eventually prison go to demand into committing suicide on camera and then airing it for ratings cheated on his wife, ruined the life and career of his mistress, tried to ruin the life of a marijuana dealer in a hardworking preschool owner, trying to turn his life around, scammed his fans out of thousands of dollars from unfulfilled Kickstarter rewards and subscriptions to a service that never yielded any content participated in endorsing several scams and pyramid schemes, including one literally run by a mass murdering member of one of the most brutal drug cartels in history, tampered with evidence in a serious sexual assault case, rendering it inadmissible in court, actively interfered in another sexual assault case that basically just held it up and prevented it from moving forward and getting any closer to finding justice and openly worked with a hacker to dox people.

(1h 13m 59s):
I just have one question, Is this your God? And on a serious note, going back to what we said earlier are the 300 pedophile arrests he contributed to still grabbing the karmic check on all these for you. Has he run out yet? I assume the answer will be different for me either way. Hansen had to know that he had pretty much got himself knee deep and proverbial shit because as his most recent live stream, as of this recording on August 5th Hanson did another major Q and a where he addressed the myriad of accusations and criticisms being lobbed at him. He reiterated that he doesn’t know who the anonymous gene is, doesn’t support doxing. And if he knew gene, he told him to stop, but can he tell him to stop without personally knowing him if gene is so Reverend towards him, can he just say, Hey, please don’t do that anymore.

(1h 14m 44s):
Without actually knowing his identity. He also addresses claims that he’s personally involved with several YouTubers that are notable critics getting their Twitter accounts suspended, saying that are completely false. What he’s referring to is that a handful of YouTubers, including the affirmation, John Swan had their accounts completely shut down on Twitter. And it was speculated to Hanson was somehow involved in getting the accounts suspended. He goes on to say that he doesn’t have any inside influence at Twitter. But remember when we said that it wasn’t quite the end of the story for perverted justice? Well, one of the key members, notable decoy and frequent onscreen presence for perverted justice during the T cap days, Del Harvey ended up going on to become the head of community and standards at Twitter. Yeah.

(1h 15m 24s):
She’s literally the one in charge of suspending people’s Twitter accounts and making judgment calls on what does or doesn’t constitute good conduct on the platform. And just drill down into this for a second, the person with short hair who was in like a shitload of, to catch a predator episodes who would always be standing in the kitchen when the predators would come in and they, the person would yell and kind of like a hype higher tone voice, like I’m in here, come in here, whatever, Hey, that person who was in a shitload of those episodes is now the head of community and standards at Twitter. That is the strangest piece of this whole story.

(1h 16m 5s):
To me, that is so fucking bizarre. That’s like, if you told me that, like somebody from G4 back in the two thousands was now like Obama’s chief of staff or some shit like that, you know what I mean? Like it was, it’s so weird. The weirdest part is like I had seen probably two or three episodes of to catch a predator, but I know that person, I know the Distinctive face and look to her. Okay, fine. Just because she works there. It doesn’t mean that she sacrificed her job, her ethics and her reputation just to help out her old colleague, Chris Hanson. Right. What if I told you that Del Harvey is literally being investigated for corruption as we speak for suspending Twitter accounts, as a personal favor for a friend, there is currently a scandal going on with Twitter or a Twitter account named spazzy O is going around accusing various large Twitter accounts of using inauthentic tactics to grow their Twitter followings.

(1h 17m 2s):
And then within 24 hours, the account is suddenly suspended. And after doing some digging watchdogs discovered that Spezio seemed to actually Del Harvey In real life and is friends with her. This story is real weird that there’s a lot of detail to this that can’t really be like quickly summarized this account. Number one, this, this, this whole thing is so strange. And like, what the fuck are you doing with your life? This account goes around and finds these large Twitter pages that this person perceives that they must have grown their Twitter page in some kind of cheating way, because there’s no possible way that this Twitter account could have grown this big in this short amount of time or that this Twitter account with this few followers has this tweet that has so many retweets and that they must have used some kind of illegal against policy cheating tactic to do this.

(1h 17m 60s):
And first of all, I have to know that that’s just not true or this person just doesn’t know what the fuck they’re talking about. I mean, there are pages that do like buy followers and use all these weird backend tactics to like grow pages and things like that. But it’s not out of the ordinary or impossible for a page to go randomly viral and have a tweet that has hundreds of thousands of retweets. But the page only has a couple thousand followers. And I know that for a fact, because literally I have a friend who recently had a tweet go mega viral. It has almost a million likes. It has like hundreds of thousands of retweets. And this tweet just went viral out of nowhere. And her, her page, wasn’t nothing beforehand.

(1h 18m 42s):
Like she had a couple thousand followers and, you know, she would do tweets and they could, they could do well. But this happened out of nowhere. It went massively viral. It’s been talked about on TV shows, every like buzz feed refinery, 29 new site has done an article about it, Mariah Carey retweeted it. And then her retweet of it also went viral and also created a story around it. And her page only went from like 6,000 followers to 9,000 followers. So this person could in theory, see my friend’s page and be like, you paid for followers, you’re doing this illegal thing because they don’t, they don’t know what the fuck they’re talking about, but they’ll go onto these pages and they’ll comment.

(1h 19m 26s):
And there’ll be like, you used in authentic tactics to grow your page. And you’re going to be found out and stopped because you are doing something illegal and against policy. And number one, it’s so weird to me that this person is obsessed with this. Like if you, if you go and look at these tweets and these comments that they’re leaving, like, what do you care? What, like, what, why are you so obsessed with this? It’s so weird to me because this is not some worthy social justice. Cause if this person was going around, like calling out people for creeping on underage girls online or spreading misinformation or saying racist stuff or whatever, but to like this weird obsessed gatekeeper for calling people out for buying followers, why do you care about that?

(1h 20m 16s):
That’s so weird to be a concerned citizen about whether people are buying followers or not, but they go in the common, all these pages, they’ll, they’ll comment, this thing, calling them out. And then within 24 hours, the page will get deleted. And then they ended up basically finding out that through a series of looking at all these different accounts and things like that, that he seems to be friends with Del Harvey. So now there’s this investigation into whether or not she’s abusing her power in her position to basically just do personal favors for this guy and suspend accounts that he personally is suspicious, are doing something illegal.

(1h 20m 59s):
So it’s not so hard to believe that she do something similar for Chris Hanson. Is it there’s a lot about this Q and a that rings disingenuous as YouTube. And one of Hansen’s notable critics, Edwin Costa pointed out in his response video to the Q and a, I hate how distracting it is. Some people criticize that, oh, stop focusing on Chris Hanson. It’s like the reason why I focus on Chris Anson is because he makes it about himself. If you don’t see it, that just doesn’t make any sense because if he didn’t make it about himself, people would not be talking about him. Why are people talking about him more than they are talking about the issue? Is, is it really the people’s fault? Or is it his fault? One of my big criticisms on Chris is like, what, what is it? What is what it, what is the objective here?

(1h 21m 39s):
Because not only do I not know, but your, your interviewees also don’t know, you know, it’s been expressed that besides getting exposure, which they’re not remembered for, or at least not their stories, what’s really happening. They’re not getting the resources. You promise them, they’re not getting the justice. You promised them. So what are you doing? And YouTube body language and behavior expert, Derek van Schaick also goes into detail about the manipulation tactics that Hansen employees, What Chris Hanson was doing throughout most of his Q and a that you saw, it was deflecting and amplifying. That’s very common of someone who is deceitful. It’s also very, very effective. The reason why it’s just so effective is because the subject doesn’t really have to lie that much, because all they have to do is amplify the allegations, take the most extreme version of the allegation and tell the truth that that’s not true.

(1h 22m 32s):
And that’s what Chris Anson was doing. A lot amplifying Claims tried to make this look like somehow I backed Pablo Escobar Denying those amplified claims to come across as more Truthful, that couldn’t be farther from the truth. And then going into flecting. I covered the cocaine wars in the eighties and nineties. I was in the jungles of Bolivia with the DEA rating, cocaine labs. Yeah. It’s very, very effective for someone who is deceitful. And you may be wondering why would someone go through that instead of just telling a bold face lie? It’s because lying is very difficult. It’s very stressful. It’s very dangerous and it’s very uncomfortable and everything else around that, right? A lot of anxiety, a lot of fear, like it’s just not fun to lie.

(1h 23m 14s):
It’s a lot easier to tell the truth. So if you can easily go and amplify and then deny those amplified allegations, you’re in a lot better position to come across as more truthful until you have people calling you out and saying, Hey, that wasn’t the question I asked you. Chris Hanson was in an ideal position where he was in complete control over what questions he decided to answer or not answer because the questions were coming in and he can just take the most extreme question. Memos, outrageous question over the top, see, that’s the thing. He was not being interviewed one-on-one he was picking and choosing the questions that he chose to answer. And that’s pretty much just what he always does.

(1h 23m 56s):
His whole YouTube phase of his career, or in any of his dealings with any of these stories, he gets away with his utter incompetence by doing exactly what he describes there, where he will take all of these criticisms. He’ll act like he’s responding to them or he’s act he’ll act like he is willing to hear the criticisms. And he’ll do like live streams where he’s actually having people commenting and he’s responding to the comments, but he’ll only seek out the comments that have the most egregious over the top accusations. And he’ll respond to those and be like, no, it’s ridiculous. I, I’m not, I’m not supporting Pablo Escobar.

(1h 24m 36s):
It’s like, that’s not the problem that nobody’s saying you’re supporting public bar. We’re saying that you accepted $50 to endorse a scam fishing product created by a mass murderer brother of Pablo Escobar. But he won’t respond to that nuanced version of the question. He’ll just say, like I don’t back Pablo Escobar. I covered the cocaine epidemic in the eighties and took down a drug ring. He does that with everything. Everything is like that since the Q and a, there haven’t been a ton of new developments in this weird ass story of a once revered journalist turned in competent old man, Mr. Magoon, his way around in the lives of a bunch of childhood assault survivors, trying to make enough money to make the payment on his boat.

(1h 25m 18s):
Apparently his current girlfriend is actively cyber-stalking some of these assault survivors and bullying them. So, you know, that’s cool. So yesterday I was on John Swan’s live stream, you know, just like hanging out, just watching it, which was completely relevant to Chris Hanson. Like nobody was talking about him whatsoever and the men and I got in there, this person like G news, they posted like three different random things. Like I hadn’t even talked. And I think I said like one thing in the beginning of the stream, and then this was like 20 minutes in and they started going on about like, I know why victims don’t want to talk to Ashley because they’re mad at her. And I don’t blame them or something like that. And I was like, wait, what?

(1h 25m 60s):
That’s definitely 100% anonymous Gene, the G news it away. And then after all the creepy messages and like knowing extra information, there’s no way that’s not Jane saving better than it does. Like they were making like tangible sentences. Yeah. So the, so at the, at this time they didn’t know who this was. That was literally going into an unrelated stream and like harassing her and criticizing her. They, they kind of thought it was anonymous gene at the time, but it turned out that it was Chris Hanson’s fiance. That was just taking it upon herself to go into these things and call out somebody who was sexually assaulted by a pedophile and just trying to find justice for herself and other women who experienced the same thing.

(1h 26m 43s):
And while there really isn’t much of a concrete end to this bizarre saga, at least not yet. It all, once again comes full circle. Back to the questions asked in the beginning of episode one, what have the nature of Chris Hanson’s motives ever been? Was he ever in this to help people or was he always just there for the fame and the paycheck, but he just used to be better at hiding. It is his current incompetence, just a result of his old age, catching up with him not being as sharp as he used to be. Or is it the apathy of someone who isn’t really emotionally invested in these stories? Like he might’ve once been because he’s so consumed by the abject sadness of his personal life. Can we view the man in the entirety of his life and like some kind of moral Dr.

(1h 27m 25s):
Manhattan view the thread of his life as a circle with no beginning, middle or end, just disconnected moments. And in weighing each of these moments equally and not waiting one over the other, based on their existence in time or the good things he’s done enough to balance out the bad. Is he still a redeemable problematic fave or has he truly morphed into something that we should reject because of the damage he has caused these young women in his pursuit of relevance can anything he’s done be classified as truly selfless, knowing everything we’ve just spent. God knows how many hours learning and if not, does it matter? Does the impact of the man render the intentions of the man? Irrelevant? I honestly want to like Chris Hansen despite everything, but anytime I start to rationalize his actions, I think about that laptop, the evidence that could have potentially had that guy behind bars by now the disappointment in Ashley’s eyes, when she talks about how she had believed Hansen would help her get an FBI case going.

(1h 28m 19s):
It’s hard to reconcile that even against 300 confirmed predator arrests. And, you know, I’ve seen some criticism from listeners calling out the hypocrisy that we are saying that Chris Hanson is exploiting these stories for profit, but that we ourselves are also exploiting these stories for profit by the very act of doing these podcast episodes. And there probably is some hypocrisy there. And what I mean by that is being on this side of things and taking an objective step back. I can see how Hanson would get so caught up in telling the story that he might lose sight of how his actions affect things. When you get so fixated on one singular goal, one path in front of you. And the further you go in quest for it, the more you double and triple down, the more things in your periphery begin to fall away and you become blind to them.

(1h 28m 59s):
You can even see that in the way that I inadvertently use deadnaming language in my obsessive quest to lay out the timeline of events in the case, in a very clear and concise way in episode two, if you can consider us a part of the media complex, there’s much to be said about the media’s role in these cases and where the line is between advocacy and exploitation. When a serial killers at large is the media advocating for the victims by blasting the killer’s face all over every screen in the country, or are they exploiting a tragedy for views and in the process giving the killer exactly what they wanted attention. This is literally the question that I hope this entire three episode podcast series would cause you to ask yourself. And we are not above that scrutiny either aside from the fact that I’d love to live in the reality where we’re actually profiting off of this podcast and not actively losing money investing in it.

(1h 29m 45s):
I’d like to think that the difference between what we’re doing and what Chris Hanson is doing is that we’re being more conscious of our role in the bigger picture. We’re trying to let the subjects of our stories speak for themselves rather than speak for them, even if that means serving as mouthpieces for them. When we don’t actually have access to an exclusive interview and clearly drawing the line between fact in our opinion, and that we’re being honest about our level of expertise and the amount of help we can bring to the table, which is low key, very little we’re straight up just to idiots who would like to tell stories that we wouldn’t tell a sexual assault victim, that we could help them get their evidence to the FBI in order to make people feel like we’re important, hot shots, and then literally make it inadmissible in court through our own incompetence.

(1h 30m 26s):
But the truth is, I don’t really know if what we do is any different. It’s truly bizarre that we, as a species take trauma and pain and human suffering and synthesize it into TV shows, movies, and podcasts. I think at one point it was just an information delivery system, but as news reporting and media slowly became more and more interconnected with commerce business and somehow entertainment. I think we all slowly lost track of why we truly do this. I don’t think anybody knows anymore. I thought about that over and over again, as we researched, wrote, recorded and edited this. And I think about it with every single episode we’ve produced since I think about our role in the ripple effect of human pain and conflict.

(1h 31m 5s):
I think about why we do this. I think about the fact that I might be completely up my own ass thinking our show is even a tiny blip on the radar, but mostly I just think about how he paid Chris Hanson, $50 to call himself. Thanks for listening to this episode. You should definitely go like the Facebook page for the deep cuts pod, because we do lots of cool video content on there that you’ll be sure to like also please join our faces. That’s deep cuts podcast on Facebook and the deep cuts podcast. Facebook group also follow us on Instagram at .

(1h 31m 45s):
That’s fine. I have a bunch of thoughts, but the main thing that I want to talk about with that last section is there’s something really dystopian to me and really bizarre and interesting on an anthropological level. And then also deeply sad that there are entire ecosystems of people that have their own pseudo TV shows that are about beefing with each other over who is trying to stop his pedophile, these various pedophile situations.

(1h 32m 28s):
Like it’s really, really weird. Yeah. It kind of reminds me of the, the talking head panels in the dark Knight returns. Those like those, like those, like, you know, those grid, the grid panels where it’s just all these different, like super dystopian, just little snippets of random news coverage and weird talking head moments going on. Yeah. And especially when like it’s dark, what, what Chris Hanson is doing. No, no doubt about it. It’s really weird and shitty. And, but it’s also really weird that everyone else is also doing it too, to a certain extent, because like we have actual law enforcement agencies that are supposed to be doing this.

(1h 33m 14s):
And granted, obviously we know that the do we know that the police and the government doesn’t always work for the individual, but it’s, it’s so bleak to me that there’s this entire ecosystem of people who are so either a underserved or B don’t feel that they’re being served by the justice system, that they need to turn it into a mini sideshow, both for their own entertainment to excess, to excise their own obsession and also to attempt to shed light on this thing that isn’t being acknowledged. Yeah. And, and that’s kinda what I wanted to talk about. I mean, you know, there, there’s, there’s a couple of layers to that.

(1h 33m 59s):
The first layer of it is Chris Hanson is doing all these things the way that I sort of described it as him, Mr. Redoing it around through this community that he doesn’t really fit into. And he’s doing everything really poorly. And up to a certain point, you could just say like, oh, he just sucks at trying to do this. But then he crosses that line and actually gets into a situation where he is actually causing damage. And that’s where it becomes the most egregious. And you know, honestly, honestly like all that stuff up in the front, like him cheating on his wife, I don’t really care about that. Even the stuff, even the thing where the guy committed suicide, like it’s exploitative that he wanted to go and film it, but like he didn’t Fracture prints your digital photos directly onto glass making your favorite moments come alive in vivid color hand, assembled in the USA.

(1h 34m 53s):
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(1h 35m 34s):
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(1h 36m 16s):
That to me is like some damning thing. It’s all, it’s all just really gray. It’s a lot of, it’s a lot of grayness and a lot of like, oh, like, I don’t know how, I don’t know what, what the, I don’t know how to navigate this ethically. That’s the part where it’s like, this is too, this is over the line. Like you have, you have sort of caused damage in a little bit of an unforgivable way or at least a way that makes me, you know, not be able to side with you or subscribe to you. Yeah. But it’s even further than that though, because it’s, I mean, yes, I agree with everything you’re saying, Nate, he’s weird. And obviously exploiting these situations for his own personal gain.

(1h 36m 57s):
100%, that’s one discussion zooming out one layer, looking at the fact that there’s a whole ecosystem of digital vigilantes doing the exact same thing and potentially causing real harm to people. Like that’s the thing that’s really strange to me. Well, that’s, that’s what I was going to say is like the one layer is that is the Chris Hanson thing, but then there’s another layer where as I was like delving deep into the story and just watching hours and hours of, and honestly, like I did not know what I was getting into covering a story that has unfolded in like the age of social media.

(1h 37m 37s):
Like we haven’t done a story like that yet. And I just did not know what I was getting into. So I have watched so much content. And also another interesting thing about it is episode, episode one, all that research, it all took place within news articles, Reading news articles, all of that research came from reading old news articles. And some of it was watching old footage from news clips and things like that. Episode two and three, literally, no writing exists about that. There’s nothing written there’s no, there are no typed words that tell any of that story.

(1h 38m 20s):
My script for this episode is the only place where this story is written down somewhere. All of this stuff exists on YouTube in vlog videos. And so in delving into this story and the research of it, watching all these hours of all these videos, I got, I got really into it. And I, and I sort of wanted to take a step back and be like, man, like I need to take a step back from this. And like reassess, where I feel like I’m landing on this, the compass of this, because I don’t, I feel like I maybe have gone too far down some rabbit hole here. So Chris Hanson’s calling you call these people drama, YouTubers.

(1h 39m 3s):
And he sort of saying in a very critical way. And he refers to them as the goon squad, all of these, all these YouTubers who are calling him out and they have this adversarial relationship with them where they’re just like, this guy sucks. He’s doing all these things wrong. We’re doing it right. We are the morally superior people in this situation. We’re the real advocates we are doing this. Right. He doesn’t know what he’s doing. He’s trying to, he’s trying to insert himself into this community that just doesn’t belong in. And I’m looking at it from another perspective and kind of saying like Chris Hanson is undoubtedly doing this way shittier than anybody else is doing, but shaggy.

(1h 39m 47s):
But I mean that he’s doing that way better than anyone else is doing. But you guys, this, this community of people that just make do these live streams, they act like they’re actually being selfless and altruistic. And that Chris Hanson is not, and he’s doing it for views. You have a YouTube channel that you make content for to grow an audience. Like you’re doing it for views to like you, you, you just are like, and even whenever they demonetize monetize videos or donate revenue to charities or whatever you missed out on like 300 bucks or something like that, or even less, you missed out on 50 bucks because of how shitty, you know, monitored. That’s A, that’s a, that’s a Chris Hanson cameo.

(1h 40m 29s):
Oh yeah. Nevermind. That’s yeah. I I’m gonna go do a live stream right now. Also there’s just so much weird. There’s also just so much weird stuff where like anonymous gene in air quotes. Like he’s not actually anonymous related. He’s just a guy who like, has whatever hacking skill he has. And he’s like, I don’t know, miss do some stuff. Like all of these people are kind of like busy body. He, you know what I mean? They’re all like now look there. There’s obviously there are people who have been wronged and there are victims and I want justice for them. And I don’t like my heart breaks for that girl who had those photos that Chris Hanson’s presence contaminated and now means that that can’t be pursued further.

(1h 41m 12s):
That sucks. I don’t want anyone to be hurt. I want people to be held accountable for their actions if they’ve hurt someone. But the sports commentator, amateur hour flogger sphere of people who are all like we’re journalists, like, are you, are you there? And th there’s. So I specifically wanted to say something about that. So on this topic, on what I was just saying, and then directly dovetailing off of what you just said. One of these things I watch, I was watching a, I was watching a live stream. That was a live reaction to the Q and a video that Chris Hanson did.

(1h 41m 53s):
And it was by John Swan, who is this guy who made this two-part expos a on Chris Hanson that goes through all of the stuff of like the Kickstarter campaign and screwing people over and ruining cases and things like that. And he made this video, he got on Chris Hanson’s radar, who said some critical things of him dubbed him as like the king of the goon squad or whatever anonymous Jean doxed him. He got into some kind of legal thing where he contacted the police about it and is currently in some kind of legal situation trying to like find out who anonymous gene is and Sue him for doxing him and all these things.

(1h 42m 38s):
But he did this live stream with a bunch of his other friends who were just all these other people in the community. And at some point in this live stream, they’re reacting to Chris in his video, Chris Hanson in his video saying something to the effect of I’m a real journalist. And these people are not real journalists. And they sort of like scoff at that. And they’re just like he says, he says that these people aren’t real journalists. And like, you know, th this person has like told me that they’ve read a bunch of stuff about like journalistic ethics and all these things like that. And they scoff at the idea of Chris Hanson saying that he’s a real journalist and they’re not real journalists, but he is a real journalist and they’re not real journalists.

(1h 43m 23s):
They’re just a bunch of kids with YouTube channels. They’re not real journalists. And to have that blind spot that kind of opened my eyes a little bit. Cause I was so deep into this. I was like totally on board with these people. I was like, I was using them as my true north in this story. And I was watching this live stream and I kind of realized in this moment, the blind spot that these kids had where they’ve gotten. So bro, did you get, did you get Radicalized? Are you officially like a, a handsome Knight? No, I I’m. I’m I I’m just, I realized that I sh that I was not, that it was not wise of me to use these other YouTubers who were critical of them as a, as a true north, because they’re these like 22 year old kids who have YouTube channels that are completely based around, I do an hour long videos talking about how problematic Shane Dawson is.

(1h 44m 24s):
And they have gotten it into their heads, that they are like the Gonzo journalists of the internet age. And to scoff at the idea of Chris Hanson saying you are not a classically trained journalist who understands all of the, you know, deeply established code of ethics that journalists need to follow in order to deliver fair and balanced news. Obviously Chris Hanson has violated those things and he is not a good example, but he’s still right. These are just kids that do not know how to properly objectively report on the story.

(1h 45m 4s):
And That’s one of the things that I was thinking when you were playing all the videos, the reaction videos to the Q and a is that it felt like high school. Like I felt like physically like, oh God, this is so high school. Yeah, it totally is it’s and it’s, it is, it’s just like, it’s a weird, I mean, they’ve been doing this since the pandemic or since before the pandemic, but especially since the pandemic, it’s like all these people, there’s these people all over the country, all over the world, just sitting in their apartments, commuting, communicating with each other over live streams and just living out a weird social ecosystem that is very akin to high school, but it’s all just people sitting in their apartments in front of a computer.

(1h 45m 50s):
Yeah. But it’s digital high school centered around cries for justice against people who were sexually assaulted, which is that’s so bleak. It’s so bleak. Yeah. Yeah. Which is why I wanted to talk about that. I wanted to talk about the YouTubers and their role in it because I think that they positioned themselves very specifically as like, we are doing this right. And Chris Hanson sucks and he’s doing this wrong and he needs to get out of our community. And in that they’re, they’re right. In a way they, they are doing it better than he is. And he does suck at it. But in that mental process, they’ve developed a blind spot where they kind of are not self-aware of, like you said, how kind of weirdly dystopian, what they’re doing is the fact that there’s like this, this network of people who all just like have their own takes on some sexual Assault story.

(1h 46m 52s):
And it’s become like this weird cinematic universe of people sitting in their apartments, giving their take on a horrific crime. That’s that’s, that’s been done to some victim. So yeah. I mean, yeah. So you know that everything about this is super ethically gray and hard to reconcile and hard to really parse out what you feel about anything specifically, without turning over in your mind several times, trying to like get to the root of your perspective on it, whether it’s that, or, you know, just to go back, you know, like I want to go back to the discussion of, to catch a predator.

(1h 47m 33s):
And the fact that people watch that show and are very entertained by it. I mean, we kind of covered that a little bit, but you know, I just to reiterate what I said before, like with the show, I never watched it. I’m aware of it. I know who Chris Hanson is. I’m aware of it as a meme basically. And I’ve seen clips from it to varying degrees over the years. I know what the format is. I know how the show works and I’ve seen some of the most famous ones, but for me, my feelings on it have always been like, I’m glad that all these pedophiles got arrested, but I have no interest in watching this weird Colosseum spectacle.

(1h 48m 18s):
It feels weird. Yeah. It’s very weird. But it is so compelling. Like when you were playing those clips, I was like riveted. Yeah. Cause who, who wouldn’t be? That’s what I, going back to what I talked about before of like how it’s the perfect show, who wouldn’t be. It’s like the it’s it’s, it is a universally agreed upon enemy and a universally agreed upon evil. And the way that they’ve formatted is so perfect where you get, you get a little taste of the anger and the disgust, and then you immediately see them confronted shamed, humiliated, and then arrested. And it’s got a little humor in it.

(1h 48m 60s):
It’s like the perfect thing. So if you watch it, you will get sucked into it. I don’t, I don’t like reality TV. I don’t, I just don’t having worked on a couple of TV shows and stuff like any time. What about bacon and legs? The writer’s strike years. Oh yeah. Those were rough. I kind of liked those, but they were rough, you know, having worked on a couple shows and knowing how those editing processes work. Oh yeah. I’ve, I’ve edited reality TV and it’s fucking horrible. Yeah. Like when a little while ago, when that love island show came out, somebody tried to get me to watch a couple of minutes of it and they were interviewing somebody and they were using footage that they were trying to paint the specific contestant as being dumb.

(1h 49m 49s):
So what they did is they asked the person a question that was very simple question. Like, have you ever had sex before? Or have you ever been in love before or something like that? That’s a personal question that someone wouldn’t want to answer necessarily, but you know, the people in the show they’re supposed to be an open book or whatever. So they get asked this kind of probing question or, you know, whatever, they get asked a question where there is a definitive answer that you’re supposed to come back with. And then the soundtrack kind of turns into the like, but I don’t know that dead end dad, I’m like silly music to play under when someone’s dumb. And then they put footage of that person sitting there, not talking, making them look like they couldn’t think of an answer to give that wasn’t that wouldn’t shame them.

(1h 50m 36s):
The issue being, if you look at the person’s eyes, they’re like tracking back and forth, listening to someone, ask them a question. So that means the producers took footage. That was not the direct response to that question and use that footage to make this person seem really stupid. And I guess that’s what you sign up for when you go on reality TV show. But those, those decisions of how the crystal in castle of reality TV is constructed is so apparent to me because I’ve worked on stuff like that before that it drives me crazy.

(1h 51m 17s):
And I can’t, I can’t not see the kayfabe. Like there was one job I had where it was. It was honestly, it was one of the worst days. I’ve I don’t want to say in my entire life, but it was goddamn clothes. It was really bad. And I did some serious soul searching. After I left, I was working on a, I was working on a show that was a lifetime original show. That was a, it was a show called preacher’s daughter. And it was basically a show. It was a reality TV show where you follow four families, each family, the father, the matriarch, or the patriarch of the family is a preacher, various sex.

(1h 51m 59s):
And they all have rebellious daughters who want to do something that doesn’t conform to the family’s faith. One of the women wanted to be a, a porn actress. One of the women wanted to have a child out of wedlock. And I don’t remember what the other two women wanted, but they wanted things that were whatever’s. You want to be a stripper or she wanted to do something that would be, societaly looked down on from a conservative point of view. And we were shooting a commercial where it was an interior set of a house and they had all of the families there and they brought these various 17, 18, 19, 20 year old women, however old they were into this house set.

(1h 52m 43s):
They put them in a chair and in the kitchen, and then they had their parents come in and yell at them for 20 minutes. And they were using these. They were using this setup as the commercial, where it was like you, the viewer are going to simultaneously be entertained by a, how weird and conservative and controlling the fathers are. And B you’re going to get off on seeing these girls get hurt. You’re going to, you know, the drama, the conflict of how could this person want to be an adult actress when they could have this other life. And, you know, it’s literally the, I mean, they’re not actors it’s that, that young woman’s actual father sat there and screamed slut at her for 20 minutes.

(1h 53m 31s):
It was awful. It was awful. And I almost quit like three or four times and I didn’t end up coming back after that. I worked that whole day. And then I just couldn’t, I just couldn’t do it anymore. I was like, this is fucking awful. Like this is actively cancerous for the culture. You did take an AP credit though. I did. Yeah. I was a executive for his David Bass, but I feel very similarly about multiple aspects of this Chris Hanson thing, where there’s so much pain, that’s being mined for entertainment. Now look, these pedophiles who tried to do wrong.

(1h 54m 12s):
And then they got caught and arrested. I don’t, I don’t have a moral quandary with seeing somebody that was trying to fuck a kid squirm. Like that’s not what I’m talking about. I’m talking about all this other stuff of like this guy committing suicide and them airing the footage, all of this weird ecosystem of people, theatrically, performatively, grieving, and calling for accountability in this bizarre dance of just existential grief. Like it’s so sad to me that like, I mean, I don’t know, what’s worse ignoring these things like they’re not happening.

(1h 54m 54s):
Like, of course I want these people to be brought to justice. Of course I want victims to have their day in court and to feel vindicated and feel seen and feel heard and supported. Of course. Yeah. But just set up the stings, Lauren, the pedophiles arrest them and don’t make a TV show about it Or, or this YouTube stuff that’s happening now where it’s just like, people’s whole identities are wrapped up in the conspiracy theories around this, this awful trauma. In some ways it’s kind of like many, it’s like the lifespan of a star, you know, where they get the waxes and wanes, you know, and it it’s, you know, it’s a red door, if it’s a regular.

(1h 55m 40s):
And like it’s, it’s almost kind of the modern day digital equivalent of the Manson trials where it was like, Charles Manson did this thing. It reverberated throughout the culture. Everybody discussed it, dissected. It was obsessed with it. It defined the American experience for an extended period of time. And then collectively, we somehow moved on from the grief of Sharon Tate’s murder and we, the world moves on and we did what we had to do. You know, we, we collectively were like, oh my God, this is awful. The world would ever be the same.

(1h 56m 20s):
We pulled our hair out. And honestly, culture is different because of Charles Manson and the chair and Tate murders and everything that happened from helter-skelter all of that stuff. But there’s like many versions of that. Now that same story is this story where it’s, there’s this awful crime. We can’t comprehend that these people haven’t been brought to justice, we’re going to collectively grieve in this theatrical way, but on YouTube, in an ecosystem of 400 people like it’s. So With all this drama where it’s like, oh, this person, you know, they did some videos and they were, they were good videos. And they interviewed these people and they were good. But then they in a different video, they said something weird. And then now like they’re problematic.

(1h 57m 1s):
And then one of the, one of the victims was originally, you know, they were the one of the first victims to come forward and they were going on these shows and talking, but then they kind of broke off from the other victims and they started doing problematic things. And now, even though she was a victim of this person, like now she’s a bad guy. And Like, I just can’t even handle all this shit. Like it’s just, it’s seen politics. It happens in music. It happens in comics. It happens in the punk scene. It’s everywhere. It’s that weird, like, look at me, I’m king of the hill. I’m the best I know the answers. And then you get toppled over and there’s another person that looks exactly like you’re saying the same goddamn thing. Like it just, I don’t have any time for that drama.

(1h 57m 43s):
I don’t want it in my life. I just, that approach to existence is just antithetical to the way that I live. And look, if you want to spend your time doing that stuff more power to you, but it’s also really dangerous to me that all of these people are winding themselves up into this fervor, that what people are getting doxed, people are assuming that users are other users using pseudonyms and fake accounts. And it’s just a matter of time before that stuff spills into the real world and people get really hurt and people are framed because the, my worldview is correct.

(1h 58m 24s):
I’ve spent 400 hours on YouTube talking about this. I will make reality conform to what I think is true. And it’s just really, really dark to me. Really scary. Yeah. And I, I think th th the things that I’ve think, like, In my opinion, the things that are sort of valid to cover in that way is like the, the fact that Chris Hanson did these things. Like, that’s what you make a video about. Like you, like, you make a video about like this Chris Hanson is to catch a predator guy. Like he’s, he’s doing this weird shit and interviewing people and like being exploitative, like, that’s the thing that you make a video about because that’s, that’s something that actually needs to be brought to light and, and, and sort of be use a platform to show that to people, but building an entire brand off of like this one person’s like sexual assault story is so weird.

(1h 59m 24s):
I’m Dave baker and I’m Andrew Price. This has been deep cuts. You can find me online and Hey, Dave baker.com or hopefully I will not have been doxed for taking part. In this video. You can find comics like, fuck off squad and action hospital. Andrew, where can they find you on the internet? You can find me doing another call-out video on my massively successful commentary YouTube channel. And you can also find me at da price, rights.com, where you can get my book deadbolt, AI, private eyes. You forgot the name of your book. I, we have literally, we recorded a three-hour podcast last night.

(2h 0m 5s):
I did another podcast earlier today, and we have literally put in an eight hour shift on this podcast. My mind I, now my inner dial, my inner monologue is just Chris Hansen’s voice I’m crusade engine. Welcome to deep cuts. Once you get off this call with Dave, you’re going to eat the leftover potato salad that you left on the nightstand. Fuck it. Let’s call it Jesus.

(2h 0m 46s):
Oh, wow. Deep cuts is a production by boy genius media. If you’d like to find this show and others like it, please visit boy genius, media.com or deep cuts pod.com. If you want to join in on post episode discussions, please join the deep cuts podcast. Facebook group. Finally subscribe to our YouTube channel for additional video content. The incidental music for this episode was created by whose music can be found at.

(2h 1m 27s):
We keep on hours.bandcamp.com and suicide. Who can we found on Facebook at P S E U D O C I D E with spaces between each letter, because apparently Facebook doesn’t the use of the Latin stems Side and the dead boy detectives who welcome back all you floorboards and RA Jockers out there to Hillsborough pirate radio station. The only short wave radio station on earth playing exclusively. The top 40 hits from my home planet. The name of which cannot be uttered in the English language without prematurely inducing the coming of Ragnar rock brand new banger.

(2h 2m 10s):
And if you don’t like it, you can take a long, hard look at a big old sloppy pair of squawk. Joe. This DJ is breaking old. I’m going to have the PC police busted on the studio door after that one, but if you snowflakes can’t handle real talk, you knew where the dial is. Maybe Delilah is no witching hour and up next, we’re going to spend the hottest track from the dead boy detectives. The hell is this.

(2h 2m 51s):
Oh, or Andrew, Dave messing around with my record collection. Again, I can’t play this bullshit on Hillsboro pirate radio station. Fuck it. It can’t be that bad. okay.

(2h 3m 45s):
I am bruise up here. confetti to Sparco Thanks again for listening to true crime by Indy drop-in.

(2h 6m 57s):
If you would like your show featured, reach out to us at indie drop-in on all social media or go to Indy, drop in.com. See you next time. Fracture prints your digital photos directly onto glass. Making your favorite moments come alive in vivid color hand, assembled in the USA. Fractured glass prints are a unique and beautiful way to display and share your favorite moments. Simply upload your photo at fracture, me.com select your size and your glass print will be shipped to you. Ready to hang with just one screw use code pod 15 to get 15% off your order today. That’s code pod fifteen@fracture.com. Get really into your favorite shows and movies all in one place with flex a 4k streaming box.

(2h 7m 41s):
So you get free with Xfinity internet and get peacock premium at no additional cost. Learn more at infinity.com/flex restrictions apply requires postpaid, Xfinity, internet, excluding internet essentials, one device included.